Robert C. Martin, or ‘Uncle Bob’ as he’s affectionately known in the industry, is one of the most influential people in software history.
He has been a software professional for over 40 years, and in that time has worked on hundred of projects; authored a series of landmark books (including Pattern Languages of Program Design 3, Designing Object Oriented C++ Applications using the Booch Method, More C++ Gems, Agile Software Development: Principles, Patterns, and Practices, Extreme Programming in Practice and UML for Java Programmers); and published dozens of influential articles in leading journals. He is the founder, CEO, and president of Object Mentor Incorporated, based in Illinois.
Robert C. Martin was also one of the driving forces behind Agile software development, and one of the authors of the Agile Manifesto.
Agile is at the heart of who we are, how we work, and what we do at Azullo. In fact, it could be argued that without Agile, there might not be an Azullo (along with a great many other companies and products we take all for granted).
Regular readers of this blog will know we’ve regularly look at how Agile can be applied to web development and broader aspects of business. We’ve been through each of the 12 principles in turn. Our company strapline is ‘Think Agile’ – so it made sense to go the source and ask Robert C. Martin a few questions.
Almost a decade has passed since you co-wrote the Agile Manifesto. What were your expectations and hopes for Agile back then?
My expectations and my hopes were two different things.
In many ways my hopes for agile have been wildly fulfilled. In other ways I’ve been deeply disappointed. In both cases my expectations were wildly exceeded.
I am thrilled that Agile has become mainstream. I did not expect that adoption would be so enthusiastic, and so general. Nowadays, Agile is just the way that software gets done. It’s a word that’s on the lips and minds of everyone in the software world.
Agile was conceived as a way for programmers to get closer to customers. I am deeply disappointed that it has evolved into a scheme for project managers to earn merit badges. The fact that the merit badge schemes are multiplying does not bode well for the future of Agile.
The original torch of the Agile message has changed hands, and is now being carried by the Software Craftsmanship movement. These are the folks who continue to pursue the technical excellence and professionalism that the drove the original founders of the Agile movement.
Were there any specific experiences that led you to start thinking in terms of Agile?
In 1995 I was a C++ consultant. My clients kept asking me about the process they should be using. As I researched the issue for them I stumbled upon Kent Beck’s work with Extreme programming. We met in Munich in 1998, and began to plan courses and conferences.
What would your advice be to developers that are starting out today?
Read! Learn! Never stop learning. Learn many languages. Learn many disciplines. Practice TDD and never let it go. When you write code, write the best code you can. Never succumb to the temptation to rush. The only way to go fast, is to go well!
Do you think businesses outside of software development can apply Agile principles to the way they work?
I think most businesses and human endeavors already make use of Agile principles. Most are based on short cycles with lots of feedback. Certainly corporations are run that way. I think that the software world was relatively unique in adopting a waterfall mentality.
What do you see as the future for Agile?
If we can get past the current certification kerfuffle, and refocus Agile back onto technical excellence, communication, and professionalism, then I think the future of Agile is bright. On the other hand, if we continue with the certification-wars, I think Agile will devolve into irrelevance.
What are you currently working on?
I’m learning Clojure, and maintaining FitNesse. I’m also working on a new book, The Clean Coder, which is all about the non-technical aspects of being a professional programmer. Things like how to make estimate, how and when to say no, how to avoid making implied commitments, how to deal with pressure, etc.
We’ll be reflecting on Robert C. Martin’s comments in the coming days.
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Great interview – can’t wait to read the new book!
Nice job with the interview–interesting and relevant read.
Here are some of the Tweets since we posted this interview…
agcjunior
“Read! Learn! Never stop learning.” – Uncle Bob http://bit.ly/d2lRQF
about 11 hours ago via web
Reply Retweet
2 Retweets
edgarddavidson
Interview with Robert C. Martin, co-author of the Agile Manifesto http://bit.ly/a9yR6b
about 15 hours ago via Seesmic
murillomr7
RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
about 15 hours ago via Echofon
rodrigoy
RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
about 15 hours ago via yoono
2 Retweets
michaelmayrde
RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
Sat Aug 21 2010 12:41:09 (BST) via TweetDeck
TheManojKumar
Interview with Robert C. Martin, co-author of the Agile Manifesto http://tinyurl.com/27wewfw
Sat Aug 21 2010 04:44:23 (BST) via TweetDeck
noelsharpe
@unclebobmartin:”I am deeply disappointed that it has evolved into a scheme for project managers to earn merit badges” http://bit.ly/d2lRQF
Sat Aug 21 2010 00:29:11 (BST) via TweetDeck
ajaydanait
Warning for Certified Agilists RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF
Sat Aug 21 2010 00:22:20 (BST) via TweetDeck
mkubicina
RT @chadmyers: “I am … disappointed [Agile] has evolved into a scheme for project managers to earn merit badges” http://bit.ly/d2lRQF
Fri Aug 20 2010 21:44:02 (BST) via TweetDeck
ryanmccollum
A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it. (via @unclebobmartin)
Fri Aug 20 2010 20:44:40 (BST) via Twitter for iPhone
rafaeldff
From @unclebobmartin interview http://bit.ly/aOvfV0: “Agile was conceived as a way for programmers to get closer to customers….
Fri Aug 20 2010 18:48:13 (BST) via web
sandromancuso
RT @unclebobmartin A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
Fri Aug 20 2010 18:31:11 (BST) via Twitterrific
esdrasbeleza
“Read! Learn! Never stop learning. Learn many languages.” – Robert C. Martin, um dos autores do Manifesto Ágil. http://bit.ly/a9yR6b
Fri Aug 20 2010 18:24:36 (BST) via Seesmic Web
Tungano
RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
Fri Aug 20 2010 18:20:16 (BST) via TweetDeck
BrianStorti
“The only way to go fast, is to go well!” – http://bit.ly/d2lRQF – interview with @unclebobmartin
Fri Aug 20 2010 17:44:27 (BST) via TweetDeck
perttuauramo
“I am deeply disappointed that it [Agile] has evolved into a scheme for project managers to earn merit badges.” http://bit.ly/aOvfV0
Fri Aug 20 2010 16:16:41 (BST) via Echofon
kuryaki
The original torch of the Agile message has changed hands, and is now being carried by the Software Craftsmanship http://bit.ly/clhQUp
Fri Aug 20 2010 16:15:26 (BST) via bitly
bjnortier
Uncle Bob: “Nowadays, Agile is just the way that software gets done.” http://bit.ly/cCO8jz
Fri Aug 20 2010 16:05:44 (BST) via Tweetie for Mac
TheSandyWalsh
“I am … disappointed [Agile] has evolved into a scheme for project managers to earn merit badges” – @unclebobmartin http://bit.ly/d2lRQF
Fri Aug 20 2010 16:02:47 (BST) via TweetDeck
1 Retweet
flowchainsensei
TR @activelylazy The Agile torch has changed hands, now carried by Software Craftsmanship movement: http://bit.ly/d2lRQF | Pure tosh
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:59:17 (BST) via web
1 Retweet
activelylazy
The torch of the Agile message has changed hands, now carried by Software Craftsmanship movement: http://bit.ly/d2lRQF /via @unclebobmartin
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:55:50 (BST) via TweetDeck
1 Retweet
danielvlopes
A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it. (via @unclebobmartin)
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:41:18 (BST) via Tweetie for Mac
luizsignorelli
“Never succumb to the temptation to rush. The only way to go fast, is to go well!” @unclebobmartin interview http://bit.ly/d2lRQF
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:39:58 (BST) via Chromed Bird
kerryb
“The original torch of the Agile message…now being carried by the Software Craftsmanship movement” http://bit.ly/cBY3pY /by @unclebobmartin
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:29:20 (BST) via Echofon
1 Retweet
yatskevich
“The only way to go fast, is to go well!” said @unclebobmartin in his interview http://bit.ly/d2lRQF
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:29:08 (BST) via web
dalnefre
.@unclebobmartin A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:28:26 (BST) via web
iamnotgonnalie
“I am…disappointed [Agile] has evolved into a scheme for project managers to earn merit badges” @unclebobmartin http://bit.ly/d73iKg
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:25:34 (BST) via web
beccio
RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:24:29 (BST) via Tweetie for Mac
jleverenz
RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:24:09 (BST) via HootSuite
lillesand
“The original torch of the Agile message (…) is now being carried by the Software Craftsmanship movement.” http://bit.ly/d2lRQF
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:18:45 (BST) via web
1 Retweet
pedroreys
RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:13:37 (BST) via TweetDeck
xbourguignon
RT @unclebobmartin A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:13:24 (BST) via Seesmic
markhneedham
RT @capotribu: RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:11:30 (BST) via Osfoora HD
1 Retweet
AdrianLogan
Azullo: Interview with Robert C. Martin, co-author of the Agile Manifesto http://is.gd/ery6M Whoteheartly agree #agile
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:09:25 (BST) via tweetz
capotribu
RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:04:50 (BST) via Tweetie for Mac
JanVanRyswyck
RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
Fri Aug 20 2010 15:04:21 (BST) via DestroyTwitter
scrumdonkey
i’m deeply disappointed that [agile] has evolved in2 a scheme 4 project managers 2 earn merit badges http://bit.ly/9Kus3s ~@unclebobmartin
Fri Aug 20 2010 14:56:36 (BST) via TweetDeck
1 Retweet
az1
liked! RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it
Fri Aug 20 2010 14:53:51 (BST) via TweetDeck
1 Retweet
chadmyers
“I am … disappointed [Agile] has evolved into a scheme for project managers to earn merit badges” – @unclebobmartin http://bit.ly/d2lRQF
2:53 PM Aug 20th via web
15 Retweets
alshalloway
RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
2:50 PM Aug 20th via TweetDeck
JanWillemTulp
RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding #Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
2:48 PM Aug 20th via tGadget
F1Dev
RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF
2:47 PM Aug 20th via TweetDeck
jsonmez
RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
2:47 PM Aug 20th via Trillian
DFWScrum
RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF
2:47 PM Aug 20th via TweetDeck
vanderleidotnet
RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
2:47 PM Aug 20th via TweetDeck
bastos
RT @unclebobmartin: A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
2:47 PM Aug 20th via Seesmic Web
unclebobmartin
A brief interview with me regarding Agile after 10 years. http://bit.ly/d2lRQF Some of you aren’t going to like it.
2:43 PM Aug 20th via TweetDeck
30 Retweets
TheSoftwareGang
#Agile #Software Interview with Robert C. Martin, co-author of the Agile Manifesto …: Robert C. Martin was also … http://bit.ly/cyNISM
12:42 PM Aug 20th via twitterfeed
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